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Feb 15 2007

Porn yet again

But first: Hasselhoff. I was so attracted to my revulsion to the mass-valentine Norbizness sent to all his feminist girlfriends that I thought I’d share it with all my feminist girlfriends. Click the foto for the hetero Village People love ballad.

hasselhoffvalentine.jpg

Sorry.

Next: blamer Amysue reports that she has been obliged to contemplate internet porn against her will. An assignment in her digital photography class requires her to submit photos to JPG magazine. JPG is an amateur photography website and sometime print periodical calling itself “The Magazine of Brave New Photography.” Exactly what makes it “brave” and “new” is unclear, as it is also, somehow, intended “for people who love imagemaking without attitude.”

Don’t ask me why anyone would want go around making pictures without ‘attitude’. Expressing a viewpoint or an inclination or a perspective or even, god forbid, a feeling, is what separates human photographers from the invertebrates. Which is not to say that, even when they do express a viewpoint, many human photographers do not remain indistinguishable from slugs.

But I digress.

JPG The Magazine of Brave New Photography solicits reader submissions in assorted categories (“Entropy,” “Loneliness,” etc); readers vote for their favorites; winners get published in the print zine and receive a hundred bucks. Don’t ask me why people are always confusing democratic process with art. I can’t think of anyone less qualified to pronounce on truth and beauty than some sweaty, anonymous electorate.

But I digress.

So Amysue checked out the JPG website and you’ll never guess what happened. One of the three main submission categories turned out to be “Beauty Redefined: Alternative pin-ups.” The category is the only one with a sponsor, and that sponsor is — you’ll never believe it! — our dear old drinking buddies Suicide Girls dot com!

Creeped out by this smutsational incursion into her academic career, Amysue dashed off an angry letter to JPG’s editor. Sadly, I think I can aver with reasonable certainty that JPG is unlikely to consider the commodification of women a principle over which one seriously contemplates parting with porn sponsor lucre.

Photography, alas, has always been the most smut-enabling of the media. Dudes are one thing, but dudes with cameras? Yipes. Even in straight-up professional photography magazines there’s always at least one naked male fantasy cliché unimaginatively rendered by some semi-erect buttmunch. Anyone who has done time among the “creative class” has met too many sleazy photographers to disagree that, among all species of artiste, they are far and away the horndoggiest. You chick musicians know what I’m talkin about.

Anyway, a click-thru of the submissions in the “Beauty Redefined” category reveals the unsurprising result that most amateur photographers “redefine beauty” as “hot babes.” Internet porn is mainstream American experience. So much so that even if we were to take JPG’s editors at their word when they call themselves “folks who shoot for love, not money” (cite), we can’t be sure they really know the difference.

72 comments

  1. Clio Bluestocking

    I was just sitting down to lunch, too. So much for that.

  2. Twisty

    Sorry, Clio. It’s sort of sad and ironic, ain’t it, that someone who loves lunch as much as I do should write a blog that prevents people from eating it.

  3. norbizness

    Did anybody seriously expect to win at Three-Card Alternabeauty Monte?

  4. KMTberry

    WOWZA, that’s some BAD amatuer photography!!! OUCH!!! Must wash eyes

    But mostly from the BADNESS, the pornaliciousness takes a serious backseat to the mind-numbing mediocrity

    L*O*V*E the new header Twisty! Bee-ooooti-ful!!

  5. KMTberry

    HA HA my digital camera takes about an HOUR between pressing the button and the “snap” of the um “Snapshot”; Naturally I was very enamored with YOUR camera, the one that takes pictures the whole time you are pressing the button! What a great feature. So I decided to buy one!

    Hilarity ensued. That is one hell of a camera you got there.

  6. FemiMom

    JPG site asks for: “smarts, enthusiasm and DIY attitude.”
    Does that last one have anything to do with a constipated facial expression? I saw a whole lot of *too cool for school* (and lots of boobs).
    I guess my undergrad years WERE a long time ago!

  7. Chris Clarke

    I will go so far as to opine that the photo on that site by photographer Nick Payne Cook, entitled “Nora,” is kinda nice.

  8. pisaqauri

    “You chick musicians know what I’m talkin about”
    Here, here!

    “Beauty redefined” as if “a rose by any other name…”
    -how bewitching and entrancing it all seems…

    going down the same-ole-patriarchal shitter in it’s neat little bow. Pink. Tied. Barf.

  9. cycles

    From the page:

    Beauty Redefined

    Every generation redefines what is beautiful, but ours has taken it to a whole new level. This theme invites you to throw out traditional notions of beauty and start over from scratch, redefining beauty for yourself.

    … (blah blah more blah blah)

    Remember: This theme is about sexuality …

    I find it odd that most of the page talks about groundbreaking ways to perceive beauty, which might include, maybe, the beautiful aspects of traditionally ugly things (the lovely swirls of color in a puddle of oil and brake fluid in the gutter), or ways to depict non-visual beauty through a visual medium.

    But then it slams you at the end with “Nope, we’re talking about the sex gaze.” As if you thought it could be anything else. Duh, stupid. And because our idea of sexiness is largely defined by the p., I probably shouldn’t have been surprised that most of the pics were regular-ass snaps of hot chicks in various states of bondage. Yawn.

  10. pippa

    I liked “Nora” too. However, the rest of the offerings were unbelievably bad. So faux-arty – f’arty if you will. Yes, I’m happy with that moniker. F’arty, pornographic rubbish. Amysue has my sympathies.

  11. Sylvanite

    I wish that we had a more varied idea of “beauty” in the west. Like the Japanese aesthetic concept of “shibui”, beauty that is revealed with age. I mean, I guess we might have such appreciation, but not so much in that photo contest. There were a few people who seemed to have submitted entries that indicated that they didn’t really read the rules, since the photos are not of young “hotties.”

    I’m sorry to say that when I was 12, I was much enamored of the Hoff. I’ve since recovered.

  12. CafeSiren

    Don’t ask me why people are always confusing democratic process with art. I can’t think of anyone less qualified to pronounce on truth and beauty than some sweaty, anonymous electorate.

    On the photo-sharing website I’m on, there is a mystery algorhythm that pops up the 500 most “interesting” photos of the day, based on (among other things) number of times viewed, and number of people who called it a “favorite.” But look at the interestingness archives, and you’ll find an overabundance of sunsets and bald eagles. Democracy doesn’t determine sound science, and it doesn’t determine good art. If it did, Thomas Kinckaide (sp?) would be hanging in the Metropolitan Museum of Art.

  13. Rainbow Girl

    Unfortunately, most people’s idea of re-defining beauty is “pink is the new red” or “corsets out, garterbelts in”.
    Suicide Girls seemed kind of fun at first but at a certain point, one’s personal revolution must extend further than making punk women hot.

    It’s pretty much the same as the “I Like Big Butts” model of social change for the perception and use of women’s bodies-you just have to replace the old-school beats with punk guitar, the rapper with emo vocals, and the word “butts” with “piercings”.

    I like to think my generation’s contribution to sexual equality will get a little further than first base.

  14. jo

    As a chick musician I know what you mean about photographers. Why are they always asking you to lie down?

    I went for a family photograph recently, and out of my mother, father, brother, sister and me, guess the sex of the person asked to lie down for a more “informal” family photo?

    (No prizes)

  15. Twisty

    Lying down! How true. Here’s an amusing picture of my old boy band. Guess which one I am.

  16. Pony

    Ouch. The shoulder.

  17. smmo

    Are those rosettes? I am at a loss and tempted by the caps lock key. ROSETTES!

  18. kate

    Many of those photos remind me of my attempts at photography in my younger days when I had more free time. Then I grew up and saw I wasn’t making any statements like I had imagined.

    I remember clearly the confusion welling up inside me as a young girl, feeling lesser because I didn’t ‘understand’ the art of a woman’s body. As I turned page and page of the many art books at home, looking at so many women portrayed in compromising or etheral poses, naked, exposed, vulnerable. And I was told it was art. I was told the enlightened eyes of understanding would allow me one day to ‘appreciate’ the ‘human form’ which of course, included only women. Women as viewed by men.

    Small wonder that when I started to become a woman myself I had churnings of conflict. What was this body now? Was this body my entire being? Am I to become art now, a two dimensional figure, splayed out for all eternity, for the appreciative gaze? If a beautiful woman is revered then is not my ultimate goal to be a beautiful woman to be loved and revered? Am I artwork on display for the pleasure of all who turn their heads to look, like all who turn the page in the art book, or the corner in the museum?

    Yes, of course you are, now get those heels on and spread your legs honey, you’re late for the shoot!

  19. 'soup

    Lurking when I shoulda been working! But I had to tell y’all I had some sort of epiphany today when I read in the SG thread about alternamen liking us tough, feisty but tiny-seems like since I lost thirty pounds I’m getting a lot of that jive-and I’m past double-nickels. My much younger housemate said she got the same treatment when she was seriously depressed and underweight after her mother’s suicide-the dudes were swarmin’ her.I can think of a number of short women who get the same treatment even though we would take you out in some fashion if crossed and some of us are outright monsters.
    Our local *alternative* press continues to exist only because of ads for prostitutes and American Apparel. One ran a freaky article about how happy the reporter was that his girlfriend got a Brazilian before swimsuit season.

  20. Hattie

    This is such boring stuff. What’s the point. Who is the target audience. What the hell do think they are doing.

  21. Edith

    Blah blah stupid sexy art stupidness. This is exactly why I haven’t taken the REALLY AWESOME course at my college on GENDER AND SEXUALITY because, this being San Francisco, half the assignments are things like, “Review these various porno mags and compare them in some sociological way or something!” and “Tonight, we’re all going to a burlesque show, for credit! Isn’t this class the most funnest ever?!”

  22. Amysue

    Fortunately, my teacher is totally feminist and awesome so we’ve been talking a lot about the whole S.G. thing. The saddest thing, though, is there are a lot of younger women in my class who think the whole thing is OK, and spent a lot of class time commenting on the weirdness or hotness of the photos. It made me sad for the future.

  23. dryad

    I recall with squirming horror my own encounter with a dude photographer. At the tender age of 14, I went with my grandparents to a meeting of the local photography club they belonged to. I was preparing for a trip overseas and wanted to learn how to take good pictures. So, I’m looking at a cheesy portrait of an 11-year-old girl in a frilly dress when the artiste himself appears at my side, with his huge brown cow eyes, neatly trimmed beard, turtleneck, and acid-washed jeans. He explains to me that the kinds of photos he really likes to take are more “artistic.” After that, the only words I remember are: “lying down, “”rose petals,” “mirror,” and “tasteful.” When he asked me if I was interested in modeling for him, I directed him to my grandfather, which was sadly unfeminist of me, but I was young and utterly creeped out.

  24. kiki

    I attended art school in Chicago with a freaky photographer like the one you describe. He was a bit older than the rest of the class and took pictures (he called them portraits) of his pitiful member and titled the series, “dick, deep in thought.” Ack. He offered his photography services to girls in the school who aspired to be “models” and there were actually several who took him up on his offer. For final critique he had made a porn video with this naked girl (from the class!)performing “highly charged symbolic acts” and several of us just walked out. The professor (a woman) thought he was “witty” and would berate us for our lack of a sense of humor. ha ha. The predatory nature of most male photographers creeps me out. I’ve been a professional artist for over *gulp* 20 years and I won’t even let one photograph my paintings.

  25. Violet

    “Beauty re-defined” was interpreted almost without exception to mean “Helmut Newton as channeled through the sweaty, Cheeto-stained paws of a horndog amateur operator of a web cam”. You can see that the majority of them were trying really, really hard to imitate the sleek, high-tech, soft-porn look favored by glossy men’s magazines, and that alone should disqualify their submissions right there. The unintended humor comes with the photographers’ (sic) earnest attempts to transform their mallrat “models” into Dita Von Beyonce Kornikova. The end result is not unlike ‘American Idol’ during audition week when the eccentric and tragic hopefuls perform their painful parodies of the Pussycat Dolls, only this time the aspiring “artistes” are deluded hipster dudes from redneck college towns who have moved up from surreptitiously photographing their own dicks on a basement rec room web cam to snapping actual live females.

  26. mearl

    Wow. That tasteful photo of the Hoff brings out his bewitching beauty.

  27. manxome

    I signed up to vote for the mannequin, which was aptly titled “Permanently Predefined Beauty”.

  28. Bonnie

    Twisty, apologies if you have already told us unwashed masses – what digi-cam do you own / use? I wanna get one for my fabulicious gal.

  29. Cecily

    There were a few really witty, cutting or interesting interrogations of the beauty concept in there. Of course, the association with SG doomed them to drown in a mire of ‘reimagined’ T&A.

  30. Stormy

    Twisty, I really must register my utmost disgust at the hoff picture, you should have trigger warnings on such vile images.

    A quick flick throught the “beauty re-defined” category, and I see that femicide is being fashionably defined, re-defined, whatever.
    This is disturbing:
    http://jpgmag.com/photos/67975

  31. Twisty

    “Naturally I was very enamored with YOUR camera, the one that takes pictures the whole time you are pressing the button! What a great feature. So I decided to buy one! Hilarity ensued.”

    See, that’s what I mean when I say all cameras should have that feature. It’s insane that you need some kind of HAL 9000 in there in order to write images that fast. Hence the non-populist price-tag. It’s not fair.

    Bonnie, my camera info is here.

  32. pleiadeswoman

    Anyone else notice how overwhelmingly WHITE the new, brave beauty is? There are some people of color, hooray, but not nearly as many as I would expect. It seems that the white/blonde look is at least as easy a target for re-definition as is the pornalicious bit.

  33. Frumious B

    I’d like to see Amysue submit some true altera-hawtness; maybe a woman with her clothes on doing nothing in particular – gorcery shopping, or reading a science fiction novel.

  34. Clio Bluestocking

    I also noticed how much of the “Brave New Beauty” looked very much like a Calvin Klein ad. Undone pants on taut bellies. Please!

  35. Rita

    All men are evil. Period.

  36. Bonnie

    Thank you!

  37. Twisty

    Well, this is a point I’ve made before, but “beauty” itself, insofar as it is applied to women’s physical appearance, has got to go. “You look beautiful tonight” should be considered hate speech. Seriously.

  38. octopod

    Oh, I’m curious about that point but I can’t find it in the archives. In what previous post is that mentioned? I’d like to question that assertion but I should probably read the reasoning first. Where is it?

  39. Twisty

    Yipes, octopod, I can’t remember exactly, but the argument against feminine beauty is essentially the same as the argument against femininity in general. I crib from myself:

    Femininity is a set of practices and behaviors (boob jobs, FGM, ‘beauty’, the ‘veil’, the flirty head-tilt, pornaliciousness, BDSM, fashion, compulsory pregnancy, marriage, et al) that are dangerous, painful, pink, or otherwise destructive; that compel female subordination; that exist only to benefit Dude Nation; that are overwhelmingly represented by ‘girly’ feminists as a ‘choice’; and that are overwhelmingly represented by godbags and other irritating conservatives as ‘natural instincts’. In fact these practices and behaviors are nothing but inviolable cultural traditions in abject compliance with which comfort, contentment, and personal fulfillment are inextricably intertwined, and from which deviation is discouraged by the threat of ingenious punishments ranging from diminished social influence, to unemployability, to ridicule, to imprisonment, to rape, to murder, to the policing of feminist blogs.

  40. the first born fish

    As a young feminist about to ship off to art school to study photography, I’m a little afraid of the amount of time I’m going to have to spend around horndog boy photographers. :(

  41. Twisty

    I feel for you, first born fish. You only hope is to consider as entertainment the highly unoriginal antics they go through with their female models. Document it in a blog! It’d be a huge art school phenom.

  42. mistermorgan

    Woah, her hair was black

    These guys are really pushing the envelope. And there was this other woman who had some fat near her armpits, at the edge of her breasts. You’d never see a professional agency let a girl like that ANYWHERE NEAR a camera. Toned pectorales major and anterior deltoid only, please.

    Yep, they really are the wave of the future. *sigh* – some of the women even had clothes on. Avant garde stuff.

    (update: 0.2% of the photos have men, so I guess I’m completely wrong).

  43. Derek Powazek

    Hi Patriarchy Blamers!

    I’m Derek Powazek, and I’m the cofounder of JPG with my wife, Heather Champ. I’ve read the conversation here with interest and wanted to thank all of you for participating in the ongoing dialog.

    There are just a few points I wanted to raise:

    1. Though the sponsor of this theme is SuicideGirls, they have no editorial control. The photos and stories that will appear in issue 10 will be created and selected by our community. So, if you want to have a say in what “Beauty Redefined” means, the best thing you could do is join us, submit your work, and vote!

    2. Yup, there are a lot of typical “hot chick” photos in there so far. But it’s only been two days! We’re hoping people really think about what beauty means to them, as you are doing here. Submissions are open for another six weeks, and they usually get a lot better over time as photographers have more time to work. Personally, I hope to see as many boys as girls in the final count. The concept of “beauty” is not limited to the feminine.

    3. Beauty, and the concept of “pin-ups” in general, are controversial topics that inspire a lot of passion on both sides. And that’s exactly why we picked it as a theme. As a photography magazine, we can’t shy away from topics that might cause a stir. In fact, we have a duty to engage them. We are people who use cameras. There are important political and personal issues around imagemaking, and we want to bravely explore them.

    JPG is a community-driven publication that strives to be open and inclusive to all. So if you have a passionate opinion of what “beauty” means, I sincerely hope you’ll join us in our quest to redefine it.

  44. kiki

    “We are people who use cameras.” Roflmao

  45. Pony

    Yeh Kiki. “We are people who use cameras.” Wank wank wank.

  46. Mr. Morgan

    Derek, I’m sure glad to see that you’re so serious in your quest to redefine beauty that you were willing to accept sponsorship form a porn site.

    Plenty of people would call that selling out, but they’re just missing the bigger picture.

  47. SusanM

    Sorry.

    Yipes, indeed! What an awesome valentine. BTW, did you know there was a “Mozart” of porn? The LA Times wrote about him today; apparently he died in a mysterious accident:

    http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/music/cl-ca-fasttracksa18feb18,1,1320273.story?coll=la-headlines-entnews

    I must admit, I really never expected to see “Mozart” and “Porn” in the same sentence, but I live a sheltered life.

    I love you, too, Twisty. You make the hate easier to wade through.

  48. mearl

    Derek, are you sure that CAMERAS are the only things you guys are using?

    P.S. That was rhetorical. Ha ha ha.

  49. thebewilderness

    I linked this in a comment thread below, but I see that it is appropriate here. It is the essay on the male gaze Twisty shared with us some time ago. There are several fascinating essays about advertising as well.

    http://www.uvm.edu/~tstreete/powerpose/index.html

  50. thebewilderness

    “So if you have a passionate opinion of what “beauty” means, I sincerely hope you’ll join us in our quest to redefine it.”

    Redefine, exploit, redefine, exploit. I’m guessing exploit, right off the top of my shaggy grey head.

  51. edith

    Hahahaha.

  52. su

    Is it my imagination or has the Hoff had one of those labial lasers installed in his head.

  53. Lara

    Derek Powazek wrote: “Personally, I hope to see as many boys as girls in the final count. The concept of “beauty” is not limited to the feminine.”

    You’re sponsored by pornographers, and looking for pin-ups of children for your viewers to wank over?

    And you decided to advertise this on IBTP – why, exactly? No really, explain. I’ve got popcorn.

  54. pisaquari

    “Beauty, and the concept of “pin-ups” in general, are controversial topics that inspire a lot of passion on both sides. ”

    Pin-ups, specifically, are “controversial” because we cannot get over calling them that. You’d think after the *thousands* of years women have been used to “pose sexy” (as defined per era) we’d be over it. But NO, because if we keep calling it “taboo” and “naughty” all the consumers needing to arouse themselves get the extra twist (not Twisty twist, of course, that might imply neutering) of feeling “dirty” and that heightened feeling someone is doing something they are not supposed to.

    Which is sick.

  55. Lara A.

    As an amateur photographer and one who posts regularly and spends too much time (heh) on a website called TrekLens (www.treklens.com), I have to say I am sick and tired of half-nudie and sexist shots of women being passed of as “artistic” and “provocative.” Interesting how these misogynists claim they support free sexuality and “free speech” when they’re actually just supporting the speech of privileged white males to continue the discourse of woman-bashing in those lousy photos. I was happy to see a token few photos of older women, women who don’t necessarily fit the Western mold of “beauty” (and the cat ;)). Nevertheless, Derek Powazek is in completel denial of the fact that everyone knows who will “win” in this race to “redefine” beauty. I bitch out photographers who put up sexist and gratuitous T&A photos on TrekLens all the time and have often been criticized and harassed for it (ex: “I don’t see these photos as sexist, it’s a matter of personal taste…” OR “you might have issues with your sexuality”…., etc. etc., blah blah blah…..). By the way, my username on TrekLens is “rychousmama” if you ever wanna look at my stuff and my occassional rants against sexist photos. Join the photography website for free, it’s super easy, but be careful it’s addictive, and join me in battling stupid male (and female chauvinist pigs) photographers who think their sexist shitastic photos are “art” or “edgy”!
    -Lara

  56. kiki

    Hmm…A contest about “redefining beauty” that is explicitly couched in “a sexualized context” …sounds pretty traditional to me. So let me get this straight…the point of the contest is to (1) identify a group of people not formerly considered beautiful (which in a sexualized context means “makes a dick hard”)(2) place photos of them on a site in various states of undress(3)ask that voting occur to determine who is titillating enough despite their imperfections to qualify for the pin-up seal of approval(4) call this a “duty” (5) because this attempt to expand men’s masturbatory fantasies needs to be “bravely explored” as it deals with, “important political and personal issues around imagemaking”. And people wonder why art is fucking dead.

  57. Johanna

    I feel your pain Lara A. I’m a member of deviantart, a similar site. The photography highlighted by the staff (“Daily Deviations”) are without fail either 1. “Artistic” closeup of a woman’s nude bodyparts 2. “Artistic” photo of woman in painful fetish clothing or 3. “Artistic” photos of young women in bondage, like today’s. http://today.deviantart.com/dds/
    Yay patriarchy. *barf*

    kiki, that was a spot-on summary! Hey Derek, are you reading and learning?

  58. ginmar

    Nobody’s jerking him off, so I kind of doubt it. Then again I guess he does a fair amount of it on his own.

  59. reesespieces

    That link at Amysue’s blog: “At Dusk Makes a Blog for Us”
    Way worse than JPG Magazine, I’d think. What gives?

  60. Amysue

    Woah! I did NOT link to a porn site. Sorry. Gross.

  61. Lara A.

    You know, I am thoroughly suspicious of any blog, website, or art venue that labels itself “deviant” “offensive” “provocative” “controversial”, etc. etc. etc. Many of these sites for “art” are just trying so hard to make their traditional sexist racist crap look like it’s “going against the grain”. Pfsh, BS!

  62. Derek Powazek

    Hey blamers. We’ve gotten a lot of questions about the Beauty Redefined theme, and have tried to address them in this recent blog post. Hopefully it will help clarify our intentions.

  63. Pony

    Oh Derek. It was never that your intentions weren’t clear. There is nothing artful about the shots on your link, before or after.

    I could give you links to what you might aspire to even understanding some day if you applied yourself beginning last year, but I don’t want that site linked to porn and affectation. So painful it is.

  64. kiki

    Derek, Derek, Derek…what happened to the “concept of pin-ups” that was to be so passionately addressed? Are you “shying away” from a topic that “might cause a stir”? Shirking your “duty”? What happened to “redefining beauty” in a “sexualized context?” Methinks the photos didn’t “get a lot better over time” as you promised and instead your call for work resulted in a ton of hack porn shots. You might be “people who use cameras” but you’re also ” a guy who uses words” and the entries you received were exactly what you asked for.

  65. octopod

    Thanks, Twisty. Sorry for making you repeat your argument, but I wanted to make sure I was getting it right before I tried picking at it. If you’re willing to discuss this here — it seems there’s something else going on in this thread — I’ll jump in with both feet. Please short-circuit if it’d be better to discuss this elsewhere.
    So I’m totally on board with all this except the bit about the flirty head-tilt, which is something that (in my experience) men and women both do in equal proportion. I’m pretty keen on observing body language, and I frequently catch dudes doing things like the head-tilting and the posture-mirroring and the lip-biting, just as much as women do.
    I also don’t know how to take the word ‘beauty’ here — I assume by the quotation marks you mean that thing which people call beauty but mean instead those things culturally coded as Sexy? ‘Cause I tell my lovers they’re beautiful, and I mean it, and I certainly don’t mean to be saying anything horrible by it but I know it’s entirely possible I’m doing so and not knowing it (or in denial).
    Also — damn, that photo-essay’s good. My friend and I were discussing these sexual-provocation signals the other day, specifically the part where they’re part of the standard repertoire for most women, but men generally never learn to do them deliberately, if indeed they do them at all. I’ll have to show him that link. The specific behaviour in question was the deliberate seductiveness one sees from women in photos and videos, ads and movies and all that — frequently associated with the “temptress” role. He came down on the side of the reasoning which holds that such signals are submissive and therefore coded female, but I wasn’t so sure. After thinking about it for another day, I would tend to say that it goes the other way — that because sexual power is a priori framed as the only sort of power women have, it is therefore unacceptable for men to have that sort of power because it’s effeminate. What do you lot think?
    Sorry for the novel. Blaming now.

  66. Joe Knickleback

    Rychousmama’s photo

    What a head case.

    http://www.treklens.com/gallery/North_America/United_States/photo257633.htm

    She actually wants people to join forces to go to this website and beat up on the guys and then the submits sumpin like this to a website? Holy cow….it’s a naked photo of herself!

  67. Texan Rose

    Surely is a head case!…

    Havent you got more to do with your time Lara…than beating up on people… go learn how to take decent photos of yourself.. this is terrible.. or is this what a feminst woman looks like… YuK !!

  68. Twisty

    “Head case”? Around here, obsessive and violently incorrect deployment of ellipses consitutes insanity. YuK!!

  69. Joe Knickleback

    Twisty,
    Surely you know that a head case is not a helmet. In addition incorrect deployments of ellipses are commonly accepted in almost every blog, newspaper, magazine and media in the world. In most cases, it reduces the lengthy explanations and keeps the readers interested, doesn’t it?
    Violently? I see no violence in Roses’ post. I have taken notice of the overall attitude towards the new people who post here. It further explains the darkness and the lack of popularity of this website. If you want to have such an exclusive, private cult here, why not make it a discussion group of members only. I guess insecure people need a way to fit in and this website must allow them to be social in some strange form. It’s Too bad alot of the people here don’t really fit into the real world. Given the acceptance towards a strange “blame game”, because it’s always easiest to blame someone than to “take one on the chin” and be responsible for your own “twisted” life. That’s the path of least resistance.
    Although it’s hardly original I have to say, “If life gives you lemons, make lemonade” and I’d add, “Get the sour look off your face”. Life’s NOT that bad when you learn to accept your own shortcomings and faults. Rose voiced her displeasure of a feminist who wants people to join her in ranting on people who actually post pictures that Lara doesn’t like. SHE actually posted one herself, marking her as a hypocrite and bad photographer.
    Joe

  70. Texan Rose

    Twisty.. we know who sounds insane around here!

    Texan Rose

  71. Mar Iguana

    Joe Knickleback, thank you. I do love to starting out my day with pointing and laughing material handed to me on a platter.

  72. Crystal

    oops!
    I just read the FAQ and I think I violated several rules in that comment alone.
    Sorry!
    Feel free to delete or edit as necessary!
    Oh, and also, the things at the end about “let’s see the real suicide girls” is not a serious plug for “broadening the spectrum of perceived beauty.”

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