<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Psst! Over here! This is the thread for sci-fi geeks.</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/</link>
	<description></description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 12:39:46 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Dudes, check out these Links (Love) &#171; Grumpy rumblings of the untenured</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-187398</link>
		<dc:creator>Dudes, check out these Links (Love) &#171; Grumpy rumblings of the untenured</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Dec 2011 08:12:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-187398</guid>
		<description>[...] great suggestions for sci-fi reading and also maybe a little bit of patriarchy-blaming?  Look at this comment thread (the thread is dead but still a good [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] great suggestions for sci-fi reading and also maybe a little bit of patriarchy-blaming?  Look at this comment thread (the thread is dead but still a good [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Kristine</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-182185</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Aug 2011 02:30:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-182185</guid>
		<description>I am way too late to this thread, but I just want to thank you for it, Twisty.  I loathe Heinlein with a passion.  One of my ex-Nigels gave me Starship Troopers to read, claiming that the book was a work of genius.  I was OUTRAGED by every single word.  The neurotic manliness, the militarism, the putting women on sexually objectified pedestals while pretending to empower them, the bullshit excuses for starting wars, the fact that there was no plot- I am so glad to find out that I am not alone.  Especially after Ex-Nigel made it clear he thought I was an immature idiot for &quot;not getting it.&quot;  Fucking PRICK.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am way too late to this thread, but I just want to thank you for it, Twisty.  I loathe Heinlein with a passion.  One of my ex-Nigels gave me Starship Troopers to read, claiming that the book was a work of genius.  I was OUTRAGED by every single word.  The neurotic manliness, the militarism, the putting women on sexually objectified pedestals while pretending to empower them, the bullshit excuses for starting wars, the fact that there was no plot- I am so glad to find out that I am not alone.  Especially after Ex-Nigel made it clear he thought I was an immature idiot for &#8220;not getting it.&#8221;  Fucking PRICK.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Strigophilia</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-170768</link>
		<dc:creator>Strigophilia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Dec 2010 02:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-170768</guid>
		<description>(Apologies for possibly threadly necromancy.)

Have any other advanced blamers out there read Paolo Bacigalupi&#039;s much-praised Nebula-award-winning bla bla etc. novel from last year, The Windup Girl?  

I have not actually finished it, and as of this point have no intention of doing so, though I&#039;m curious as to whether that&#039;s giving it a fair shake.  I gave up after the second rape scene.

The book was Powells.com&#039;s featured book today, and the reviews very nicely helped crystallize why I am pretty sure it counts as literature using a thin veneer of a possible feminist slant to justify pandering to the lowest common denominator of the heterosexual male gaze.  My favorite line from one review is:  &quot;Emiko, the titular despised but impossibly seductive product of Japanese genetic engineering, works in a brothel until she accidentally triggers a civil war.&quot;  Yep, ain&#039;t nothing as sexy as a woman you can treat like garbage, amirite?

The first rape scene is one of the most horrific things I have ever read, and to give him credit, I don&#039;t think the author is trying to present it as titillating.  However, it does read as though sex with a woman incapable of consenting is not OK if you also torture her, but is totally OK if you refrain from beating the crap out of her.  

Has anyone else read it?  Does it ever redeem itself?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(Apologies for possibly threadly necromancy.)</p>
<p>Have any other advanced blamers out there read Paolo Bacigalupi&#8217;s much-praised Nebula-award-winning bla bla etc. novel from last year, The Windup Girl?  </p>
<p>I have not actually finished it, and as of this point have no intention of doing so, though I&#8217;m curious as to whether that&#8217;s giving it a fair shake.  I gave up after the second rape scene.</p>
<p>The book was Powells.com&#8217;s featured book today, and the reviews very nicely helped crystallize why I am pretty sure it counts as literature using a thin veneer of a possible feminist slant to justify pandering to the lowest common denominator of the heterosexual male gaze.  My favorite line from one review is:  &#8220;Emiko, the titular despised but impossibly seductive product of Japanese genetic engineering, works in a brothel until she accidentally triggers a civil war.&#8221;  Yep, ain&#8217;t nothing as sexy as a woman you can treat like garbage, amirite?</p>
<p>The first rape scene is one of the most horrific things I have ever read, and to give him credit, I don&#8217;t think the author is trying to present it as titillating.  However, it does read as though sex with a woman incapable of consenting is not OK if you also torture her, but is totally OK if you refrain from beating the crap out of her.  </p>
<p>Has anyone else read it?  Does it ever redeem itself?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: M. Dubz</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-165050</link>
		<dc:creator>M. Dubz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jun 2010 05:22:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-165050</guid>
		<description>@Sylvanite: I believe that the headmistress of Eton, Miss Keate, is an Alpha</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Sylvanite: I believe that the headmistress of Eton, Miss Keate, is an Alpha</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: marthafines</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-157621</link>
		<dc:creator>marthafines</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 00:36:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-157621</guid>
		<description>Merry Christmas to all... and to all a good night.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Merry Christmas to all&#8230; and to all a good night.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Wrong time wrong place</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-151590</link>
		<dc:creator>Wrong time wrong place</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:07:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-151590</guid>
		<description>And I&#039;m also stepping in very late here, but what do all the blamers think  of the Twilight books?I first read them before discovering IBTP and loved them, then tried again after my conversion. Trying to work out the most fitting edath for them - one page torn out at a time and placed on a fire? Or given to a charity shop with all the misogynistic parts commentated on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And I&#8217;m also stepping in very late here, but what do all the blamers think  of the Twilight books?I first read them before discovering IBTP and loved them, then tried again after my conversion. Trying to work out the most fitting edath for them &#8211; one page torn out at a time and placed on a fire? Or given to a charity shop with all the misogynistic parts commentated on.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bella Donna</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-151359</link>
		<dc:creator>Bella Donna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 08:42:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-151359</guid>
		<description>I know, I know, always so very late to the party.

I noted some people on here wondering at the lack of female Alphas in BNW, and thinking that the lack of them indicated sexism on the part of the author. 

I always rather thought the point of Brave New World was that in order to control the populace without obvious force, the government instead controlled them through subversion. 

And the easiest way to appease any dude is to provide him with plenty of pornulated, always, always, eager women-folk.

In order to guarantee pornulated, always eager women-folk, the government could not allow women to believe that they were in any way equal to men.

Hence no Alpha women.

Hence &quot;sex is wonderful and the best thing ever&quot; brainwashing beginning when they were children.

Hence under-developed, desperately unhappy women. 

Hence the government provides them with easy access to happy-pills, lest they ever begin to question anything.

But the women were still under layers and layers of denial unhappy in their roles, and the dudes were for the most part just having a time of it.

So, I didn&#039;t think that the BNW was so much mired in patriarchy as it was showing the logical ends of completely dominant patriarchy.

It&#039;s possible that I need to re-read it, since it&#039;s been a few years.

Also: RE: So very many Sci-Fi Utopian fantasies written by men that involve pretty much a constant orgy-fest? Well what do you think the ideal Dudes Utopia involves? Clue: 

Many, many dudes seem to believe that the only thing stopping them from getting all of the pronging that they so rightly deserve is our guilt. 

Because if you ascribe to a Christian viewpoint in the slightest you must need a logical male to point out for you that you are clearly just making up an imaginary friend to replace the worthless father you had growing up and that your abstinence from sex is clearly you trying desperately to cling to your childhood, and all of your complex psychological issues could be sorted out with a good pronging.

Ditto for women who have any sort of a relationship with their father (good or bad!)

Ditto for feminists (clearly that particular illness is caused by Bad Experiences with Bad Men and can be solved by submitting to be pronged by Good Men)

Because it certainly cannot be any sort of problem that we have with them.

So when we all evolve as a human race, women will grow past all of that silly guilt and become every bit as sex-obsessed as they are.


Sorry if I seem a bit bitter on that one. Oh wait, I&#039;m not sorry at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know, I know, always so very late to the party.</p>
<p>I noted some people on here wondering at the lack of female Alphas in BNW, and thinking that the lack of them indicated sexism on the part of the author. </p>
<p>I always rather thought the point of Brave New World was that in order to control the populace without obvious force, the government instead controlled them through subversion. </p>
<p>And the easiest way to appease any dude is to provide him with plenty of pornulated, always, always, eager women-folk.</p>
<p>In order to guarantee pornulated, always eager women-folk, the government could not allow women to believe that they were in any way equal to men.</p>
<p>Hence no Alpha women.</p>
<p>Hence &#8220;sex is wonderful and the best thing ever&#8221; brainwashing beginning when they were children.</p>
<p>Hence under-developed, desperately unhappy women. </p>
<p>Hence the government provides them with easy access to happy-pills, lest they ever begin to question anything.</p>
<p>But the women were still under layers and layers of denial unhappy in their roles, and the dudes were for the most part just having a time of it.</p>
<p>So, I didn&#8217;t think that the BNW was so much mired in patriarchy as it was showing the logical ends of completely dominant patriarchy.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s possible that I need to re-read it, since it&#8217;s been a few years.</p>
<p>Also: RE: So very many Sci-Fi Utopian fantasies written by men that involve pretty much a constant orgy-fest? Well what do you think the ideal Dudes Utopia involves? Clue: </p>
<p>Many, many dudes seem to believe that the only thing stopping them from getting all of the pronging that they so rightly deserve is our guilt. </p>
<p>Because if you ascribe to a Christian viewpoint in the slightest you must need a logical male to point out for you that you are clearly just making up an imaginary friend to replace the worthless father you had growing up and that your abstinence from sex is clearly you trying desperately to cling to your childhood, and all of your complex psychological issues could be sorted out with a good pronging.</p>
<p>Ditto for women who have any sort of a relationship with their father (good or bad!)</p>
<p>Ditto for feminists (clearly that particular illness is caused by Bad Experiences with Bad Men and can be solved by submitting to be pronged by Good Men)</p>
<p>Because it certainly cannot be any sort of problem that we have with them.</p>
<p>So when we all evolve as a human race, women will grow past all of that silly guilt and become every bit as sex-obsessed as they are.</p>
<p>Sorry if I seem a bit bitter on that one. Oh wait, I&#8217;m not sorry at all.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Frakin’ Cylontastic: Battlestar Galactica’s Other Successful Word : OUPblog</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-131118</link>
		<dc:creator>Frakin’ Cylontastic: Battlestar Galactica’s Other Successful Word : OUPblog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Oct 2008 16:22:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-131118</guid>
		<description>[...] Cylonarchy “A Battlestar Galactica-like galaxy where humans fight against a Cylonarchy? Been there, seen that, not worth the retread.” (March 6, 2007, Blame the Patriarchy) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Cylonarchy “A Battlestar Galactica-like galaxy where humans fight against a Cylonarchy? Been there, seen that, not worth the retread.” (March 6, 2007, Blame the Patriarchy) [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: nooblamer</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-130914</link>
		<dc:creator>nooblamer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 04:16:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-130914</guid>
		<description>Hey all,
Does anyone with a better rounded knowledge of Sci-Fi wanna step in here? I feel like the comments thread so far is just SCREAMIN for a response from a blamer (or a few) who&#039;s well-versed in this kind of material: 

http://io9.com/5060135/could-you-live-in-a-world-without-women

(Discussion of Sci-Fi that depicts societies or worlds without women)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey all,<br />
Does anyone with a better rounded knowledge of Sci-Fi wanna step in here? I feel like the comments thread so far is just SCREAMIN for a response from a blamer (or a few) who&#8217;s well-versed in this kind of material: </p>
<p><a href="http://io9.com/5060135/could-you-live-in-a-world-without-women" rel="nofollow">http://io9.com/5060135/could-you-live-in-a-world-without-women</a></p>
<p>(Discussion of Sci-Fi that depicts societies or worlds without women)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Token Indian</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-126416</link>
		<dc:creator>Token Indian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 19:13:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/03/05/psst-over-here-this-is-the-thread-for-sci-fi-geeks/#comment-126416</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m late visiting this thread and just had a comment.  From my standpoint as a two-spirit Native woman (Cherokee) Pat Murphy gets a lot of things wrong.  In the novel _Nadya_, she follows the path of a lot of ignorant non-Indian lgbt activists in embracing the term and concept of &quot;berdache,&quot; which is considered highly offensive by most actual two-spirit Native people*.  The term &quot;berdache&quot; was coined by white anthropologists to describe individuals they saw as cross-dressing homosexuals, first among some plains tribes, and then later applied without regard for nation.  This is offensive and reductive because it is a) an outsider&#039;s term, b) lumps a variety of gender roles all into one category, and c) applies western two-sex/two-gender norms to tribes (by assuming that these individuals were &quot;transgender&quot; when, for many--but not all--tribes--they were exactly the opposite because they were believed to occupy their own unique gender categories distinct from both feminine and masculine, hence not to be crossing genders by any means).    Certainly tribal people have never called themselves by this term, which has its origins in French, derived from Persian (where it refers to a young boy involved with an older male--hardly a value-neutral term for these people.  Native people have always had gender roles--much more balanced than Europeans--but they were until recently much more complicated (recognizing as many as six gender roles per tribe, and a great deal of occupational fluidity within each gender role) and valued  a much greater degree of individual variation and choice.

I think any minimal amount of research would have made this clear for Murphy.  She wants to romanticize Natives as &quot;accepting&quot; LGBTQ people (and, I think, give herself an excuse to write steamy scenes) without delving into what the roles meant to the people who experienced them.  I think it&#039;s just plain racist for non-Indian writers to continually write about our cultures by taking one concept, not researching further, and just making up what they imagine the concept meant.  To do so perpetuates stereotypes and misunderstandings.  I blame the colonizers&#039; narrow, two-gender-having, others&#039;-cultures-appropriating, patriarchy...

* Two spirit is, roughly, the most popular term for people today who fill these other gender categories and see their gender (not just sexuality, but a whole host of things) as having certain spiritual implications/obligations peculiar to two-spirit people.  Not all two-spirit people are glbt, and vice versa.  Some might disagree with this definition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m late visiting this thread and just had a comment.  From my standpoint as a two-spirit Native woman (Cherokee) Pat Murphy gets a lot of things wrong.  In the novel _Nadya_, she follows the path of a lot of ignorant non-Indian lgbt activists in embracing the term and concept of &#8220;berdache,&#8221; which is considered highly offensive by most actual two-spirit Native people*.  The term &#8220;berdache&#8221; was coined by white anthropologists to describe individuals they saw as cross-dressing homosexuals, first among some plains tribes, and then later applied without regard for nation.  This is offensive and reductive because it is a) an outsider&#8217;s term, b) lumps a variety of gender roles all into one category, and c) applies western two-sex/two-gender norms to tribes (by assuming that these individuals were &#8220;transgender&#8221; when, for many&#8211;but not all&#8211;tribes&#8211;they were exactly the opposite because they were believed to occupy their own unique gender categories distinct from both feminine and masculine, hence not to be crossing genders by any means).    Certainly tribal people have never called themselves by this term, which has its origins in French, derived from Persian (where it refers to a young boy involved with an older male&#8211;hardly a value-neutral term for these people.  Native people have always had gender roles&#8211;much more balanced than Europeans&#8211;but they were until recently much more complicated (recognizing as many as six gender roles per tribe, and a great deal of occupational fluidity within each gender role) and valued  a much greater degree of individual variation and choice.</p>
<p>I think any minimal amount of research would have made this clear for Murphy.  She wants to romanticize Natives as &#8220;accepting&#8221; LGBTQ people (and, I think, give herself an excuse to write steamy scenes) without delving into what the roles meant to the people who experienced them.  I think it&#8217;s just plain racist for non-Indian writers to continually write about our cultures by taking one concept, not researching further, and just making up what they imagine the concept meant.  To do so perpetuates stereotypes and misunderstandings.  I blame the colonizers&#8217; narrow, two-gender-having, others&#8217;-cultures-appropriating, patriarchy&#8230;</p>
<p>* Two spirit is, roughly, the most popular term for people today who fill these other gender categories and see their gender (not just sexuality, but a whole host of things) as having certain spiritual implications/obligations peculiar to two-spirit people.  Not all two-spirit people are glbt, and vice versa.  Some might disagree with this definition.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

