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	<title>Comments on: When women don&#8217;t blame</title>
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		<title>By: Starfoxy</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-132068</link>
		<dc:creator>Starfoxy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Oct 2008 04:49:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-132068</guid>
		<description>I know this is an old thread, but just in case it might help.

I would turn it back around on her, and say something along the lines of: &quot;Why is it so important for you to believe that this is an insignificant and isolated problem that this woman must overcome on her own?&quot; 

When the coworker responds in protest (&quot;That&#039;s not what I was saying&quot;), press on with &quot;Are you sure? Because you&#039;re putting firth a lot of effort to place the responsibility for this only on the victim. Are you threatened by the idea that this woman might have a legitimate complaint? If you accepted her complaint as valid, would that make you feel less safe in public?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know this is an old thread, but just in case it might help.</p>
<p>I would turn it back around on her, and say something along the lines of: &#8220;Why is it so important for you to believe that this is an insignificant and isolated problem that this woman must overcome on her own?&#8221; </p>
<p>When the coworker responds in protest (&#8220;That&#8217;s not what I was saying&#8221;), press on with &#8220;Are you sure? Because you&#8217;re putting firth a lot of effort to place the responsibility for this only on the victim. Are you threatened by the idea that this woman might have a legitimate complaint? If you accepted her complaint as valid, would that make you feel less safe in public?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Mack</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-130360</link>
		<dc:creator>Mack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 07:09:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-130360</guid>
		<description>Hiya,

In terms of the work safety/the woman concerned feeling safe at work issue, I reckon it would be cool to call a workplace meeting and suggest some sort of collective action - everyone wearing the same t-shirts with a slogan that go to the issue of honking and that this occurs on all shifts...

As for the fellow worker, I wish I could offer some advice, but I don&#039;t have any.

Work with those that want to see change in the world!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hiya,</p>
<p>In terms of the work safety/the woman concerned feeling safe at work issue, I reckon it would be cool to call a workplace meeting and suggest some sort of collective action &#8211; everyone wearing the same t-shirts with a slogan that go to the issue of honking and that this occurs on all shifts&#8230;</p>
<p>As for the fellow worker, I wish I could offer some advice, but I don&#8217;t have any.</p>
<p>Work with those that want to see change in the world!</p>
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		<title>By: SoJo</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-128057</link>
		<dc:creator>SoJo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 13:54:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-128057</guid>
		<description>A friend of mine invited a couple of men she met on an overseas holiday to stay in her home. One of them told her that he loved her and then proceeded to show her the photos he had been taking of her with his phone without her knowledge and videos of her sleeping. She ran around telling everyone how disturbed she was by this but said nothing to the guy, or the police, and let him stay in her home. She almost took it as a compliment- giggled about it in a semi-hysterical way.
This scares the shit out of me .... and infruriates me at the same time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A friend of mine invited a couple of men she met on an overseas holiday to stay in her home. One of them told her that he loved her and then proceeded to show her the photos he had been taking of her with his phone without her knowledge and videos of her sleeping. She ran around telling everyone how disturbed she was by this but said nothing to the guy, or the police, and let him stay in her home. She almost took it as a compliment- giggled about it in a semi-hysterical way.<br />
This scares the shit out of me &#8230;. and infruriates me at the same time.</p>
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		<title>By: JA</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127873</link>
		<dc:creator>JA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Sep 2008 17:37:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127873</guid>
		<description>the inner part of me that loathes women like that would completely take over.

&quot;that sounded just exactly like something my/a rapist said&quot;.

&quot;someone around here is obviously brainwashed&quot;.

&quot;why should i get help? i&#039;m not the one with the overarching need to dominate, humiliate, and subdue other human beings against their will...&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>the inner part of me that loathes women like that would completely take over.</p>
<p>&#8220;that sounded just exactly like something my/a rapist said&#8221;.</p>
<p>&#8220;someone around here is obviously brainwashed&#8221;.</p>
<p>&#8220;why should i get help? i&#8217;m not the one with the overarching need to dominate, humiliate, and subdue other human beings against their will&#8230;&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: PoMo</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127316</link>
		<dc:creator>PoMo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Aug 2008 21:09:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127316</guid>
		<description>Politichick--

People are rarely changed both fundamentally and quickly, and rarer so for that to happen through a cognitive appeal. As a tactic, you could try making a hard hitting emotional connection by telling a real (or fictional) account of how you, or someone you know were made to feel by the action you&#039;re trying to get them to empathize with. Give them a reason to want to see things your way - by rhetorically positioning them into being the bad guy if they dismiss your argument:

&quot;You know, when I went to high school, there was this group of guys in my class that used to hang out in the parking lot. They&#039;d have loud discussions about all the girls as they went by - about their bodies and what they liked or didn&#039;t like. You might think it sounds stupid - just boys being boys... I was pretty good at ignoring them until junior year when one of them raped my best friend. 

Ever since, I can&#039;t shake the idea that maybe the two things were connected - they way they felt free to talk about us like we were meat and the way he felt free to attack her like that. In any case, every time I hear a guy catcalling, it makes me think about her and about what happened. It makes me really mad, and it makes me wonder how many women who are getting catcalled might have been victims of a sexual assault in the past, and how the guys doing it might be making them feel, ya know?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Politichick&#8211;</p>
<p>People are rarely changed both fundamentally and quickly, and rarer so for that to happen through a cognitive appeal. As a tactic, you could try making a hard hitting emotional connection by telling a real (or fictional) account of how you, or someone you know were made to feel by the action you&#8217;re trying to get them to empathize with. Give them a reason to want to see things your way &#8211; by rhetorically positioning them into being the bad guy if they dismiss your argument:</p>
<p>&#8220;You know, when I went to high school, there was this group of guys in my class that used to hang out in the parking lot. They&#8217;d have loud discussions about all the girls as they went by &#8211; about their bodies and what they liked or didn&#8217;t like. You might think it sounds stupid &#8211; just boys being boys&#8230; I was pretty good at ignoring them until junior year when one of them raped my best friend. </p>
<p>Ever since, I can&#8217;t shake the idea that maybe the two things were connected &#8211; they way they felt free to talk about us like we were meat and the way he felt free to attack her like that. In any case, every time I hear a guy catcalling, it makes me think about her and about what happened. It makes me really mad, and it makes me wonder how many women who are getting catcalled might have been victims of a sexual assault in the past, and how the guys doing it might be making them feel, ya know?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Greenconsciousness</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127225</link>
		<dc:creator>Greenconsciousness</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Aug 2008 00:27:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127225</guid>
		<description>Reminds me of the narcissistic brats who drive into fast food places and throw liquids at the workers taking their orders. They, being the bright lights they are, videotape themselves which helps with the prosecution.  

Can you get a picture of the license plate?  That would be the first step.  Then to brain storm with National Women&#039;s Law Center or 9 to 5.  I hesitate here because so many feminists groups are not feminist anymore.

But getting a snapshot of the plates and a recording of the taunt would be No 1.  If the taunt can be characterized as a threat or hostile or &quot;disorderly conduct&quot; there are fine enhancers based on the fact that it is done in a construction zone to a worker.

What is needed is some kind of visual documentary which will bring the reality of what it is you are suffering.  A woman&#039;s movie crew can&#039;t really do it because I suppose you go for long periods with no harassment.  

Just take a picture of the plate with a cell phone (or camera)hung around your neck for the purpose.  The cell phone would allow you to call the cops with a description of the car, occupants and license plate number. You might discuss your plan with the sheriff once you get the backing of your union and get things co-ordinated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reminds me of the narcissistic brats who drive into fast food places and throw liquids at the workers taking their orders. They, being the bright lights they are, videotape themselves which helps with the prosecution.  </p>
<p>Can you get a picture of the license plate?  That would be the first step.  Then to brain storm with National Women&#8217;s Law Center or 9 to 5.  I hesitate here because so many feminists groups are not feminist anymore.</p>
<p>But getting a snapshot of the plates and a recording of the taunt would be No 1.  If the taunt can be characterized as a threat or hostile or &#8220;disorderly conduct&#8221; there are fine enhancers based on the fact that it is done in a construction zone to a worker.</p>
<p>What is needed is some kind of visual documentary which will bring the reality of what it is you are suffering.  A woman&#8217;s movie crew can&#8217;t really do it because I suppose you go for long periods with no harassment.  </p>
<p>Just take a picture of the plate with a cell phone (or camera)hung around your neck for the purpose.  The cell phone would allow you to call the cops with a description of the car, occupants and license plate number. You might discuss your plan with the sheriff once you get the backing of your union and get things co-ordinated.</p>
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		<title>By: Anarcha-Feminist Superstar</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127092</link>
		<dc:creator>Anarcha-Feminist Superstar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:47:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127092</guid>
		<description>I have actually dealt with this exact problem when I publicly accused my stalker. A &quot;radical&quot; bookstore full of &quot;feminists&quot; proceeded to tell me that I was paranoid due to the high rate of abuse in my life, that my deeper, fear-based issues needed to be addressed because I was obviously just scape-goating a harmless man who happened to be somewhat mentally ill and therefore deserving of my sympathy and help. 

Women can be shits.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have actually dealt with this exact problem when I publicly accused my stalker. A &#8220;radical&#8221; bookstore full of &#8220;feminists&#8221; proceeded to tell me that I was paranoid due to the high rate of abuse in my life, that my deeper, fear-based issues needed to be addressed because I was obviously just scape-goating a harmless man who happened to be somewhat mentally ill and therefore deserving of my sympathy and help. </p>
<p>Women can be shits.</p>
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		<title>By: monika</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127015</link>
		<dc:creator>monika</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Aug 2008 18:25:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-127015</guid>
		<description>I am very much enjoying everyone&#039;s awesome posts!

Anyways, I was thinking that the attitudes towards sexual harassment are very similar to &quot;if you are going to be raped, you might as well enjoy it.&quot;

&quot;If you are going to be violated by someone yelling about your breasts, you might as well take it as a compliment&quot;

&quot;If you are going to be punched in the face, you might as well appreciate the attention&quot;

monika/shermanvolvo</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am very much enjoying everyone&#8217;s awesome posts!</p>
<p>Anyways, I was thinking that the attitudes towards sexual harassment are very similar to &#8220;if you are going to be raped, you might as well enjoy it.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;If you are going to be violated by someone yelling about your breasts, you might as well take it as a compliment&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;If you are going to be punched in the face, you might as well appreciate the attention&#8221;</p>
<p>monika/shermanvolvo</p>
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		<title>By: Claudia</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-126690</link>
		<dc:creator>Claudia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 06:36:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-126690</guid>
		<description>Sexual harassment. Sigh. It&#039;s terrifying. Very difficult to stand up to, I don&#039;t care how strong you are.Or even tell someone about, if you grew up in the 50&#039;s. Carlsbad Caverns, NM, I was twelve. The OWM guide made sure to sit next to me in the area they turn out the lights. He put his arm around me and fondled my breast the whole time. Scared the crap out of me. He pursued me in the gift shop, and my mom picked up on his stalking and got between us. We didn&#039;t tell my dad. That&#039;s what the sorta average American household was like, or at least a small town minister&#039;s family. 

Women who are still swimming in the testosterone sea. Gentle modeling, speaking the truth, always quietly, and with a smile, is the only way to educate these frail, fragile creatures, and only when they approach you. They&#039;re like a wild animal who hasn&#039;t figured out that the hunter is Not Her Friend. One can only change ones self, we can only offer the plain truth, which becomes a tendency for change over time. 

A bully society is always dangerous for women and children. Look what our bully government is doing around the world. The way to handle a bully is to be who you are, &#039;roid up your boundaries, and interface in an aware, communicative manner. Shed light on the cockroaches.

Mil gracias to all the commenters. Most enjoyable discussion. 

Flag person: walkie-talkie or other electronic communication device. Call in any incident as it&#039;s happening. Set up a dangerous alert system for immediate backup--truck license and description to be logged at base. Make it part of your safety procedures. Then it becomes like accessibility on Web sites--good for everyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sexual harassment. Sigh. It&#8217;s terrifying. Very difficult to stand up to, I don&#8217;t care how strong you are.Or even tell someone about, if you grew up in the 50&#8217;s. Carlsbad Caverns, NM, I was twelve. The OWM guide made sure to sit next to me in the area they turn out the lights. He put his arm around me and fondled my breast the whole time. Scared the crap out of me. He pursued me in the gift shop, and my mom picked up on his stalking and got between us. We didn&#8217;t tell my dad. That&#8217;s what the sorta average American household was like, or at least a small town minister&#8217;s family. </p>
<p>Women who are still swimming in the testosterone sea. Gentle modeling, speaking the truth, always quietly, and with a smile, is the only way to educate these frail, fragile creatures, and only when they approach you. They&#8217;re like a wild animal who hasn&#8217;t figured out that the hunter is Not Her Friend. One can only change ones self, we can only offer the plain truth, which becomes a tendency for change over time. </p>
<p>A bully society is always dangerous for women and children. Look what our bully government is doing around the world. The way to handle a bully is to be who you are, &#8216;roid up your boundaries, and interface in an aware, communicative manner. Shed light on the cockroaches.</p>
<p>Mil gracias to all the commenters. Most enjoyable discussion. </p>
<p>Flag person: walkie-talkie or other electronic communication device. Call in any incident as it&#8217;s happening. Set up a dangerous alert system for immediate backup&#8211;truck license and description to be logged at base. Make it part of your safety procedures. Then it becomes like accessibility on Web sites&#8211;good for everyone.</p>
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		<title>By: bluwhisper</title>
		<link>http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-126619</link>
		<dc:creator>bluwhisper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 21:18:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2008/08/16/when-women-dont-blame/#comment-126619</guid>
		<description>Not even wearing a hijab is enough
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/16/AR2008081602063_2.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not even wearing a hijab is enough<br />
<a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/16/AR2008081602063_2.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/16/AR2008081602063_2.html</a></p>
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