Jul 28 2010

Fan mail from another flounder saddens spinster aunt

I am so sad about this guy! Apparently I’ve been deleting his comments, which comments — I’m just guessing of course — might not have precisely represented the apex of human achievement, since I don’t remember them or him.

Submitted on 2010/07/27 at 11:13pm

Post my comments. Don’t be afraid of open discourse, you wanker. Is this how Neo-Feminist nutbags run their websites? with censorship? You suck.

“You suck.” Seriously? That’s the insult?

See, this is why I’m sad. Stupid, uninteresting people keep saying things.


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  1. raven_feathers

    Your last sums up my response to this week perfectly.

  2. schatze

    At least he spelled “suck” right.

  3. Triste



  4. phio gistic

    Poor CENSORED Random Dood from Saskatchewan. He will never be able to express his ideas anywhere and it is All Your Fault.

  5. Pinko Punko

    I would have italicized “things” not “saying”, but I guess it is more harsh your way. As if the opening of the mouth is the problem and there would be no hope for any emanation originating.

  6. Sylvie

    It’s a right old shame for him, so it is – got to feel a little of sympathy for someone who thinks calling a person a wanker is a good strategy for getting them to engage in “open discourse”.

  7. Jane Q Public

    Open discourse? With this dude? Boring. Even his attempts at insults are boring.

  8. Notorious Ph.D.

    I once parked poorly on my street, and came out to a foul anonymous note stuck under my windshield wiper, objecting to my parking by calling me a number of names regarding female anatomy and female dogs. The writer was so irate that he (?) felt it necessary to turn the sheet over and continue writing on the back. And then, at the end, came the kicker:

    “Oh yeah, and your hair is stupid.”

  9. allhellsloose

    It reminds me of the wonderful quote from Labour MP Denis Healey about Conservative MP Geoffrey Howes’ verbal ‘attacks’ in the House of Commons:

    ‘Like being savaged by a dead sheep.’

    Your last line is priceless too and equally withering.

  10. Siren

    Wow, that’s fascinating. “Wanker” and “nutbag.” The worst insults the guy can come up with involve disparaging reference to his own unfortunate anatomy.

  11. sonia

    My complaint is similar in nature to yours, Jill, but is this- why do stupid people keep *engaging* with people they disagree with. Why waste a minute of your day on some website you disagree with? People only ever change their minds because they want to, or life browbeats them into doing it. “Neo-feminists” (hee haaww) don’t have enough clout in this effed up world to browbeat stupid doods into anything!

    Be happy with your advantage, dipshit.

  12. MPMR

    According to this guy’s definition of censorship, every time someone’s brilliant novel is rejected by a publishing company, it’s censorship.

    Hey, Matthew: it could just be that your writing has crappy content or crappy execution!

    IBTP for this dude’s ridiculous sense of entitlement to have his unique perspective heard on other people’s blogs.

  13. vinaigrette Girl

    Oh dear, oh dear. Best to stay silent and be thought a fool than to speak and thus prove it, mattstefanson@gmail dot com.

    {sniffles} Aw, diddums.

  14. Ma'Whis'Ki

    And of course, he feels perfectly entitled to use the imperative mood, as in “Post my comment.” Not [Are you going to post my comment?] or [Why won’t you post my comment?] or even [It is inconceivable to me that you refuse to post my comments, inane though they all are.] But, no. He’s young, he’s unremarkable, and he’s got a brain that would fit easily into his left nut with room to spare, and yet he feels it is his manifest destiny to tromp on over to a feminist blog and issue orders. IBTP.

  15. Bitch, Esq.

    I fired up my Insult-o-Matic, which chopped, diced, and pureed the insults to allow for a deep, nuanced, quantitative analysis, as follows:

    “Post my comments.” – Aggressive and manly in structure by commanding Twisty post his comments on IBTP, demonstrating a lack of understanding that it is in fact someone else’s blog and not his dedicated-commentary site (commonly known on the Internet as one’s own blog), but lacks a tagline like “carpet-muncher” or “lesbo-nazi” to really polish off the sentence and take it to the next level. The Insult-o-Matic assigned it a 1-to-10 value of 3.

    “Don’t be afraid of open discourse, you wanker.” Thinks Twisty is male – that’s a 0, right there. Although, the Insult-o-Matic spat out a caveat that perhaps Matt was trying to elevate Twisty to honorary-male to allow him to insult her in the first place, because his dignity can’t be lowered by insulting actual women. IoM settles on a 2.

    “Is this how Neo-Feminist nutbags run their websites?” Clearly identifies you as a Feminist *Nutbag* – again, treats Twisty as male, AND implies a neo-nazi throught the use of the “Neo” prefix, and therefore feminazi, connection. Subtle, but the “nutbag” reference takes it over the top and makes it too Limbaughesque. Call it a 3.

    “with censorship?” Stands (by reference) on First Amendment Right To Be An Idiot In Public Spaces. Alas. This blog is not a public space. Also, fails to explicitly claim right, instead, just tacking it on to previous sentence, giving the impression even he doesn’t take it seriously. The Insult-O-Matic gives it a 2. Clearly, the author’s heart is not into his insulting today!

    “You suck.” H. Sapiens, being a mammal, breastfeeds its young, so yes, Twisty does suck, or did at one point and no doubt reserves the right to do so again at will (this statement is not a judicial admission as I am not her counsel). An odd, vaguely surreal, choice to end an uneven and frankly subpar collection of insults. The Insult-o-Matic gives it a 3, but I think that’s out of pity.

    So, that’s 5 insults on a scale of 1 to 10, with a combined possible score of 50, and I’m afraid today’s insulter’s score sums up to an embarrassingly low 13.

    Better luck next time. Perhaps the author should consider engaging with ideas instead, if quality vitriol is beyond him.

  16. Tempest

    I love each and every one of you!

    That is all.

  17. tinfoil hattie

    Your also mean.

  18. Catherine Martell

    Siren, I assure you that women are also entirely capable of wanking.

    Also, non-Brits never use this word properly. “Wanker” is all wrong in the context of fear of open discourse, silly Canadian man! A wanker is a man (very rarely a woman) who is being arrogant. For instance, Matthew’s email is clearly the work of a total wanker.

  19. JetGirl

    Ah yes, the old “you can’t censor me, it’s illegal” argument. Never mind that in the U.S. Bill of Rights, anyway, the first amendment refers specifically to the government not being allowed to censor. A spinster aunt’s private website is not a branch of the government, so she can publish whomever she likes.
    Shorter and sweeter for the flounder: you have every right to spout your opinions in a public square. But my living room, even if it has floor-to-ceiling curtainless windows you can see from that square, is off-limits unless I invite you in.
    Oh, and about that public square? If you yell “fire!” or something that causes people to stampede and kill each other, or you spout lies about someone and destroy their reputation, you will be censored. And prosecuted.

  20. Susan

    “Post my comments. Don’t be afraid of open discourse, you _______. Is this how Neo-Male Supremacist ovary membranes run their websites? with censorship? You ____. Oh yeah, and your hair is stupid.”

    I’m looking for MRA blogs to intimidate with this pithy email, but the invective doesn’t translate well.

  21. Ma'Whis'Ki

    [Your also mean.]

    Correct! Just so I’m clear about it, I feel absolutely no obligation to be conciliatory or nice to a declared wanker. I also feel no obligation to censor my displeasure with said wanker– I deeply meant every word I said. In wild horse bands, experienced mares do not take aggressive crap off of young stallions. They kick repeatedly (and hard enough to kill if they hit the right spots) until the stallion gets the idea that the only thing aggression with mares will get him is battered senseless.

    The thing I object to the most in Matt-Wank’s comment is the entitled attitude of it. He feels completely privileged to barge into a place where he is clearly not welcome, so that *we* all know that *he* disagrees with us (i.e., he shows us he’s one of them thar manly-men). He fully expects that *his* disagreement should be given respectful note *by any and all women* because ‘that’s our job’ as he sees it. Until he shows something more than simple brain-stem reflexes in his social interactions, two back hooves to the mid-section is all he deserves, and if I hit his left testicle, so much the better. Maybe it will knock some sense into him.

  22. Carpenter

    I love how it opens with “Post my comments.” There is no way this guy is so ego-maniacal that he really believes you are going to post his comments is there?

  23. Saphire

    ‘Don’t be afraid of open discourse’

    We’re not afraid knucklehead, just afraid of being bored to death. We don’t give a shit about chads. Their comments usually have the utility of a shit pastry.

  24. lawbitch

    What a fuckneck.

  25. ew_nc

    I can’t help it. Men being rendered impotent (in all senses of the word) makes me giggle.

  26. Phledge

    It is the rare occasion when I feel inclined to make up an email address just for the purposes of fucking with people like mattstevenson@gmail, and if I had the spare time to do so it might be an interesting experiment. Ah, well, too much blaming to accomplish.

  27. Satchel

    “See, this is why I’m sad. Stupid, uninteresting people keep saying things.” Brill. This is my new motto.

    Notorious Ph.D., one time I was crossing a city street with my kids (with the light) when an asshat in a sports car came roaring up to the crosswalk and halted far too close to us for my comfort. Apparently he took umbrage at my dirty look, for he leaned out his car window and shouted, “You should learn how to walk in the city!” To which I responded, “No, when YOU come up to a crosswalk you should SLOW DOWN!”

    As we walked away, he bleated at my back, “Lady — don’t eat so much food.” ::: eyeroll :::

  28. janicen

    “You suck!” – mattstefanson@gmail dot com.

    So, how old are you, Matty? Twelve?

  29. sonia

    Satchel I hope you scratched your butt with your middle finger? That’s my fave non-response to stupid insults from doods. Virtually impossible to prove and should they choose to comment, makes them sound like a paranoid douche.

  30. incognotter

    Heh. I love to see an arrogant ass discover he cannot muscle his way into the center of everything.

    I have in my daily life an arrogant dude I cannot just get rid of. One of his favorite tricks is to give permission to do his scutwork in lieu of requesting a favor. Because you know if you say the word please” you lose 10 million dude points and your dick might fall off. I get comments like “if you’re going into town you can drop off my library books” and “you can mute the TV” (since the commercial is too loud for his sensitive hearing.) He affects to have no idea that this is bullying behavior and to think I am a nit-picker for objecting to it. I am struggling to find a response which might get through to him without getting me arrested and without “proving” that the problem is just that I am an evil control freak looking to make trouble for the poor oppressed dude.

    Do any blamers have a shockingly witty version of “what are you, three years old you jerk?”

  31. Siren

    “There is no way this guy is so ego-maniacal that he really believes you are going to post his comments is there?”

    But—wait. Isn’t that exactly what Twisty did? And not only did she post his comment, but here we are giving it all this attention. Gah! I think I just melted my brain.

  32. Ron Sullivan

    Incognotter, the response that comes to mind is, “No, thank you.”

    “No, thank you, you’ve been too generous already.”

    No, thank you, I’m stuffed.”

    No, thank you; children are starving in Chad.”

    “No, thank you, I already had one.”

    “No, thank you, I gave at the office.”

    “No, thank you; I’m overprivileged.”

    “No, thank you; it’s only Monday.”

    “No, thank you; we gave the puppies away.”

    “No, thank you; I’m on a diet.”

    “No, thank you; I’m Catholic.” (Jewish, kosher, Babtist, Clear, onomatopoetic, left-handed, celibate, menstruating, married, Working My Steps, fasting, evil, bitter, enjoying myself already)

    Channel Gracie Allen. The less relevant the answer is to whatever he’s asking, the better. You’re Distracted and Not paying Attention; you dismiss him with an amused “Hmm. Oh right, whatever” and don’t do whatever he’s demanding. Don’t bother trying to reason with him; just don’t reinforce his obnoxious behavior. He’s too dim for teaching and just needs training.

    If you’re lucky, you might work up to “Sit. Stay.”

  33. incognotter

    @Ron Sullivan (If you’re lucky, you might work up to “Sit. Stay.”)
    Not likely. I am just trying to avoid training via taser and jail time, because that’s my initial instinct. Irrelevant. I like that. I can do irrelevant. ;-)

  34. janna

    Neo-Feminist as opposed to that ever-increasing fringe-feminist group, the Paleo-Feminists.

  35. pheenobarbidoll

    “if you’re going into town you can drop off my library books”

    I can, but I won’t.

    “you can mute the TV”

    Response 1) Are your fucking legs broke?

    Response 2) Is the remote too complex?

    Response 3) WHAT??? I CANT HEAR YOU, MUTE THE TV!! (repeat as necessary)

  36. AoT

    But where are men suppose to have their opinion heard if not here? They have so few spaces in this world to put forth their thoughtful, considered opinion on how no one is thinking of them.

  37. FemmeForever

    No, thank you; I’m Catholic. (Jewish, kosher, Babtist,


    Worship much? Ron?

    (It may be a typo but since I used to be a Baptist, this mis-spelliing, whether intentional or not makes me giggle. A lot.)

  38. FemmeForever

    Darn, that’s mis-spelling.

  39. tinfoil hattie

    Ma’Whis’ki, it was Jill whom I was proclaiming “mean,” and trying to do so so in a way that Matt would understand; i.e., “your” instead of “you’re.”

    But your mean too, so don’t worry.

  40. Tehomet

    Sympathies. Is it possible that putting a capcha and the ‘I freely admit that I love and adore Twisty’ tick-the-box to the hallowed Blame form might weed a few of these educationally-challenged individuals out?

  41. Antoinette Niebieszczanski


    (Fart-noise made with my mouth) because this is the only expression he’s capable of understanding.

  42. Jill

    July 28, 2010 at 9:28 pm

    “There is no way this guy is so ego-maniacal that he really believes you are going to post his comments is there?”

    But—wait. Isn’t that exactly what Twisty did? And not only did she post his comment, but here we are giving it all this attention. Gah! I think I just melted my brain.

    Well, I didn’t technically post his comment. What I did was, I published his communiqué in the context of a blame. And the discussion need not be about him. I’d prefer, actually, if it were about stupid, uninteresting people saying things. For instance, I quite enjoyed incognotter’s anecdote because I happen to have an irascible ranch hand who thinks he’s the boss of me. His M.O. in getting me to do his work is to sidle up and casually say, “so, are you going into town in the next day or two?” If I’m not on my A-game I stupidly answer yes, at which point he’s got me: “Great! Then you can swing by Tractor Supply and pick up a bushel of linchpins and stop at the dirt guy and get 213 yards of granite gravel and while you’re on the road give whatshisname at McCoy’s a call to see why he hasn’t sent out those panels yet.” And then I’m all, “what am I, your goddam secretary? Go dig a hole!” And then Phil, my secretary, says, “What the fuck is that supposed to mean?” and quits again.

  43. janicen

    Oh, I get it, like when my Nigel prefaces any comment about a book or column he’s reading with, “Have you read any of (insert author’s name)’s work?” or “You don’t read (insert author’s name)’s column, do you?” and then proceeding to share his commentary in order to enlighten me in an area where I am clearly lacking. When I point out that he could simply make his comment about whatever he is reading without making me feel inadequate first, he becomes defensive because he is not one of those guys. He is a feminist. He is enlightened.

    I finally learned, when he starts out with a question as to whether I have read any of the work of an author he knows I have not read (after twenty years, he damned well knows what I read), I respond with, “Why?” It works. It breaks his rhythm and highlights the lack of necessity for the conversational habit which only serves to make the listener feel inferior if she hasn’t read what HE is reading.

  44. sargassosea

    Or like when your 20-something Wis Dells Relocation *Expert* apologizes for calling you and your female partner “guys” and chooses to politically correct himself with “girls”?

    That’s pretty stupid.

  45. Bushfire

    If someone informed me that I can return his library books or mute the tv, I would respond in one of two ways. Most likely I would say “I sure can!” in a voice dripping of sarcasm, then proceed with whatever I was doing. Otherwise, I might name the fee I would charge for said service, and inform Mr. Dude that the fee must be paid up front.

  46. Linda Atkins

    I would be tempted to say “Normally, a request begins with the word ‘please’ and ends with a question mark. And then later there’s a ‘thank you.'” But it sounds like maybe incognotter is not in the position to take that tone.

  47. Vera

    Stupid people saying things brings to mind the Dunning-Kruger effect, which is meant to describe a cognitive bias in which a incompetent person makes poor decisions while holding the misguided belief that he is brilliant. Because, you see, the person’s incompetence renders him incapable of understanding that he is, in fact, not superior. A corollary describes the situation in which a highly competent person does not realize that she is, in fact, superior, because she believes that if she understands a thing, then that thing must be easily understood. In other words, she miscalibrates. This miscalibration shows up, no doubt, in her communication style, which is tentative (“I think that…”) and lacking in assertions (It is a fact that…”).

    Which circles nicely back to a point Jill was making a few posts back, and also explains a lot of the men who show up to comment here.

    Also, if you Google “dunning kruger” right now, the second Google suggestion in the list is “dunning kruger Palin.” But I’m not going to touch that.

  48. tinfoil hattie

    sargassosea! My dad was born in a log cabin in the Dells. His cousin still runs one of those tour boats. What a great place!

  49. Gayle

    He sounds like a fun guy.

  50. Ma'Whis'Ki

    Tinfoil Hattie–

    I laughed *so hard* when I read this:

    [Ma’Whis’ki, it was Jill whom I was proclaiming “mean,” and trying to do so so in a way that Matt would understand; i.e., “your” instead of “you’re.”

    But your mean too, so don’t worry.]

    I must explain that I sometimes have trouble telling which short responses go with which previous messages– before the moderated messages were posted, your short response was immediately below my message. So of course, it was completely my goof, and your response was delightful. I was drinking some iced Jasmine Green Tea when I read the above, and I damn near sprayed it all over the keyboard, via my sinuses.

    Naturally, my ire-object has always been– and remains– Mr. Mattitude, along with his on-board Personal Entitlement coach (Mr. Wiener) and the 5 pounds of lard between his ears that he pretends to think with. He single-handedly makes tapeworms look intelligent, which is no mean feat of personal de-evolution/mutation. That said, I’m off for more iced tea…

  51. Shelby

    Boys are weak. Chuck ’em in the creek.

    Girls are strong. Like King Kong.

  52. rj

    Incognotter, you could try, “Are your arms and legs painted on?” or alternatively, just fuck him off. I recommend the latter.

  53. incognotter

    Twisty, maybe you need a tiny little sports car or a Smart car, just so you have no room to haul stuff. If you get a vehicle you have to put on with a shoehorn he will have to do his own work, and you will also be the envy of middle aged men everywhere. If your country is really rough, he might also be induced to live in fear of being ordered to do road work. Heh.

    I am relieved you were amused by my not-Nigel issues. I was afraid I was an annoying hijacker.

  54. Citizen Taqueau

    ingognotter, there have been a lot of good suggestions so far! My response in said sitchyation has been (because it has occurred), deadpannish, “OOOH! CAN I?” with creepy big-eyes.

    It’s just such a socio-satirical mindfuck, sort of the inverse of the old “Can I carry your books?” chivalry/chicanery chestnut.

  55. tinfoil hattie

    Ma’Whis’Ki, sorry to owe you a keyboard! Glad you enjoyed the humor.

  56. speedbudget

    Incognitter: My mom used to do the “Do you want to” or “Can you” construction when giving me the most hateful chores. She only did this when it was either a disgusting or mind-numblingly boring chore. I figured out to answer with “No, I don’t” or “Sorry, I can’t.” It worked for a little bit, but then Mom realized what was going on and changed her construction to “I need you to.”

    Maybe your Nigel won’t be as quick as my mom.

  57. Susan

    Thank you so much for naming the Dunning–Kruger effect. I had read one of the follow-up studies using self-assessment of competence in arithmetic as the metric, followed by a test to measure actual ability, but I couldn’t remember the name. It would be very interesting to structure a study in which men and women rated their competence in relation to each other. I wouldn’t be surprised if sexism caused the disparity between perceived and measureable ability to be even more pronounced in both, with women under-rating themselves compared to men, and most men believing themselves better than women at anything that “counts”.

  58. Mayday

    Susan, here’s a post on Restructure linking to a study about how men and women rate their IQs and areas of intelligences differently: http://restructure.wordpress.com/2009/05/20/men-overestimate-their-intelligence-in-all-12-countries-research-finds/
    They didn’t test for the participants actual IQs or abilities, though, so it’s hard to say to what degree on average men are overestimating their intelligence versus women underestimating theirs.

  59. Ron Sullivan


    It’s a direct transliteration from the Arkansas dialect. Don’t look at me, hon; I was raised RC and I don’t mean cola.

  60. wiggles

    The passive-aggressive approach can be pretty fun and effective, depending on circumstances. If somebody tells you what errands you can run for him, just nod along until he stops talking and then do whatever you had planned, except whatever the knob expected of you.
    After so many days late on their sodding projects or so many library fines, the knob will eventually figure out that he can’t get shit accomplished by expecting you to do it for him.
    A slower-witted arrogant dude who doesn’t catch on that he needs to ask and say please and thank you might get the impression that you’re very forgetful and unreliable, in which case he may stop expecting things of you altogether. Bonus!

    You know where I learned this trick? From dudes!

  61. Hedgepig

    speedbudget: my mother used to say “I’ll let you (insert description of chore)”, as if it was a treat. Kind of passive aggressive really. She had a perfect right to just tell us to do the chore, but she had to pretend she wasn’t just giving us an order, which she was.

  62. incognotter

    Hedgepig, that is exactly why I was never interested in honors courses in school. My mother’s way of presenting the idea was not “you can study fun things with smart kids” it was “you can do extra work for extra credit.” She never understood why I thought I had enough credit and enough soul-crushing classes. *SIgh*. I kinda wish I had managed to translate that from Mom-speak earlier because I probably missed some cool stuff.

  63. bizzielizzie

    > > I have in my daily life an arrogant dude I cannot just get rid of.

    I do sympathise. The first question is how to go about it in a karmically sound way so as to avoid stubbed toes and seagull attacks. I hear there’s a fair bit of work transporting construction materials to the east. The money’s not bad. The second question is how to talk him on to the train…

    Uh, Jill, is it permissible to employ the ellipse as a theatrical device where a full stop would imply inappropriate intonation? I’d have flung another one in there but I don’t want to spook the horses.

  64. Bushfire

    On a vaguely related note, I am really tired of this article going around called The End of Men. It’s a bunch of crap about how since women are getting more undergrad degrees and working more, that men are somehow going to “end”. At first I dismissed it as a bunch of MRAs whining but I keep seeing it everywhere and a friend of a friend just posted a damn link to it. I half want Twisty to do an analysis of the article to make fun of how stupid it is, but it’s so incredibly tedious I know it’s really not worth it.

    I just had to get that off my chest. Thanks for listening.

  65. vitaminC

    Time for the ol’ Internet Argument Techniques manual again. See number 8, First Amendment Reinterpretations:


  66. Comrade Svilova

    Bushfire, I sympathize completely. But the thing is, if women do have better degrees, better jobs, better incomes, then the men they marry (because this is a hetero-normative world, of course) will be like women which would “end” men (defined, of course, as being Not The Other).

    Of course, saying that being like a woman in a traditional family is The Worst Thing Ever is terribly, terribly misogynistic. However, I doubt the article writers would admit that. Because we’ve had equality, and we’re past it, and now it’s men getting the short end of the stick. Equality? That happened so long ago. And inequality was even further back (like decades, right?). Feminists should just get over it already and realize that they Rule the World with Iron Vaginas. Pity the poor men.

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